To turn, turn will be our delight

[venta]

In any normal circumstance, saying "turn left" to someone is a useful, sensible instruction. At least, providing the person you're talking to is able to get their left, er, right.

Somehow, though, when dancing rapper this phrase loses any meaning.

I'm not quite sure what the problem is. I think it might be partly that the person being told to turn is required to turn on-the-spot rather than in a more usual left-turn sort of sense. It might be that being caught in the middle of a tangled whirl of metal is disorientating. Or it might just be that when someone is already confused, shouting "left! left!" at them is never really going to help.

We've tried various strategies to deal with this. Saying to someone "turn the easy way" doesn't help. In theory, it should. The "easy way" is either the "short way" if they know which way they want to end facing (ie turning 90 degrees instead of 270), or if their arms are twisted, it's the way that untwists them. Again, this sort of instruction tends to result in a rabbit-in-the-headlights sort of panic as someone tries to work out which way to go.

I suppose this is the sort of reaction seen in other cases, too, when someone is confused and is required to act quickly and correctly. Quite why the stricken dithering is the human body's best way of coping remains a bit of a mystery. We all seem to do it, though.

Quite a common way of explaining turns is to say something like "turn left shoulder back". This is the same way as "turn left", but gives you something a bit more definite to grasp hold of if you're feeling a bit bewildered. Move your left shoulder backwards. Now keep turning that way.

Sometimes, though, describing things via the surroundings work better. After a failure with some "turn outwards" instructions to someone a few weeks back, I eventually opted for saying "face the window every time you turn". This of course, has its downsides... next time we're dancing in public rather than in our practice hall, you have to stop and work out where the windows, the toilets and the fire exit are to orientate yourself.

Last night we had one of your Occasional Mabels (people who live too far away to make regular practices, but can be drafted in for emergencies) along, as she's coming with us to Burton at the weekend. She kept getting a particular turn wrong. Instructions like "left shoulder back" and "the easy way" having failed, a useful description was eventually reached:

Turn as if you're going to punch Liz in the face with your right hand.

She got it right every time after that.

Scared now.

Comments

[elethiomel.livejournal.com]

The inability most people seem to have of giving (or understanding) accurate directions and descriptions is one of my endless sources of frustration and general pet hates - why can't people get used to clock-face directions or any fixed reference points. I remember the sorts of conversation I used to have with my mother in the car as a kid:

"Oooh look - a hot air balloon!"
"Where?"
"Over there."
"Where?"
"That way!" [hand waves around a 90 degree arc of sky]
"Where over there?"
"There!" [finger stabs same general area, Steve gives up in frustration and/or an argument ensues]

Conversely, the same conversation with my father would be:

"Hey look - a hot air balloon!"
"Where?"
"Um... 2 o'clock, about a thousand feet up. Ten degrees left of the church or so."

So much easier.

[venta.livejournal.com]

I've had a bit of difficult with clockface directions of late.

If, for example, I were trying to tell you that a hot-air balloon was at two o'clock, do you:

(a) assume that you are standing in the middle of the clock face, and look slightly to your left
(b) assume you are standing facing the clock, and look up and to your left ?

(Or more simply, is 12 straight forwards or straight up?)

Either of these works, it just tends to matter with the directer and the directee think they're using the same one.

[phlebas.livejournal.com]

Surely either way 2 o'clock would be to the right?

[venta.livejournal.com]

Er, yeah, er, that's what I meant.

I hasten to add that I do know my right and my left, it just seems I don't know which way clocks work.

(I blame the clock on my desk, which, since the entire dial rotates, has the numbers on it anti-clockwise. And my clock at home does actually run anti-clockwise.)

[phlebas.livejournal.com]

Aha.
A friend has a superb clock with a reversed face which hangs opposite the mirror in the bathroom.

[venta.livejournal.com]

Aye. Except mine doesn't hang near a mirror :)

I remember utterly baffling my physics teacher because I could answer instinctively which way a bottle top/screw/etc unscrewed, but had to really think quite hard about which way round a clock went.

[jiggery-pokery.livejournal.com]

I was going to say "Is clockwise a reserved word in rapper dancing with its own dancing-specific meaning?", but with this in mind, I can see why it might not come to you completely naturally to describe turns as being clockwise or anticlockwise to others.

[venta.livejournal.com]

I don't think it's just me, actually. Though I expect most people know which side of a clockface 2 is on, I reckon that in general if you say to someone "turn clockwise" they'll have to have a good think before turning.

Add to that the thinking time required to give them the correct instruction in the first place, and it's not terribly effective.

I'm curious, though. If anyone can say to someone who's not been party to this discussion "turn clockwise" and see if they get it right without undue thought, that'd be interesting. Human nature being what it is, though, they're more likely to say "no" or "why?" :)

[venta.livejournal.com]

In fact, last time I tried to use clockwise as a direction for someone (when talking about the M25), the person to whom I was talking about said "where's 12, the top or the bottom?"

It required some arguing, and indeed the providing of a watch and turning it round before I managed to demonstrate that it didn't matter where 12 waas, clockwise was still the same way.

[onebyone.livejournal.com]

Well, especially with the elethiomel family, I guess the convention is taken from fighter pilots (and, I assume at least some other pilots). In that case, aeroplanes are always located at the centre of a clockface, with their nose pointing at 12, and oriented in (what I think is) the obvious way, with 1 on the right and 11 on the left.

By extension, so are cars and people. But some people seem to get confused if you say "turn clockwise" because they don't know whether you mean clockwise as viewed from above or from below. I don't really understand that.

[snow-leopard.livejournal.com]

Ah now see I hate that. One of my housemates (and indeed thinking about it most men I know) give directions along the lines of "then you go North", North? How do I knoe which way is North? Can only assume men have some internal compass women are missing.

[lanfykins.livejournal.com]

Umm... I almost always know where North is. If I don't, I can generally work it out.

I don't ask for directions either.

Oh dear.

[venta.livejournal.com]

You're not a girl at all, really, are you ?

Actually, I do remember reading somewhere that being able to locate north in any situation was a very Scottish trait. Sounded like a load of old cobblers to me. I shall regard you as an unfortunate anomaly rather than supporting evidence ;)

[wimble.livejournal.com]

My directional sense only works on the fairly large scale of journeys of at least 10 miles.

I usually know roughly which direction I've started in, and just keep an approximate track of how much I've turned in which direction (eg. M40 to London is East, so if I turn left I'm going North).

Failing that, there are useful landmarks, such as the M1 (North!).

Once I'm into the traditional "maze of twisty turny backroads", this does go to pot, as I'm usually more concerned with finding the "third turning on the left, then nextdoor to the house with the red door" than I am about worrying about which way I'm actually facing. And even on the middling scale, it can get thrown by non-obvious turns.

For example, Oxford's High Street runs East-West at the Carfax end, but has a non-obvious bend in it around Longwall Street. And Cowley Road doesn't actually run North-South (although I always think that it does. Actually it's Iffley Road that's North-South). Of course, since I know about those two, they're not a problem. But similar gimmicks in other places can throw me.

[snow-leopard.livejournal.com]

But, but, but how?
(Though I does have to be said that I am the extreme end of the scale and perfectly capable of getting lost ven if I vaugly know the area. I am however a great navigator - give me a map and I'm fine!)

[chrisvenus]

As a point of curiosity do you turn the map around so you are always driving "up" or do you keep the map the same orientation and compensate mentally?

[snow-leopard.livejournal.com]

Erm, well USUALLY I can orientate mentally, if its an especially confusing bit I will turn the map!

[davefish.livejournal.com]

I can't manage that, nor can I read maps effectively.

On the other hand, thinking of it as 'Having an adventure' rather than 'Being lost' makes everything seem much more positive.

[chrisvenus]

Nah. We all just like confusing women when giving directions so we can then claim that women are rubbish at navigating. :)

[snow-leopard.livejournal.com]

I am GREAT at navigating, I am just incapable of judging distances and can get lost on a tuppenny piece!

[venta.livejournal.com]

Actually... would this housemate of yours be inskauldrak ? If so, maybe I do have to take this Scottish theory (http://www.livejournal.com/users/venta/110613.html?thread=1416469#t1416469) slightly more seriously.

[wimble.livejournal.com]

But if his directions always include then you go North, they're precise, but inaccurate, and won't get you (for example) to Newbury.

Maybe he's just trying to prove that all roads lead to Home.

[snow-leopard.livejournal.com]

No its fluffymark, I don't think I have ever got directions from inskauldrak so I can't prove or disprove your Scottish Theory (other than fluffymark is not Scottish).

[addedentry.livejournal.com]

Internal compass? I have one on my wristwatch.

[snow-leopard.livejournal.com]

Your wristwatch? When I was a child I had shoes with a compass in the soles but that would be rather less practical (hopping around on one foot trying to work out which was was North)